J'ai un problème concernant le Licuala elegans...
Reconnu par Kew, je n'arrive pas à trouver d'information sur ce palmier... je sais uniquement qu'il serait originaire de Sumatra en Indonésie...
Le problème est que de nombreuses personnes appellent Licuala elegans le Licuala Peltata var. Sumawongii, ce qui crée une pagaille pas possible...
Qui aurait des info ???
Licuala elegans... Kesako ?
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olivier971
- Messages : 1275
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Re: Licuala elegans... Kesako ?
L elegans est un L peltata à palmes entières (cf Palmiers du Monde)
pour moi, j'en étais resté là ..
pour moi, j'en étais resté là ..
Olivier
Mes albums photos
Mes albums photos
Re: Licuala elegans... Kesako ?
C'est donc comme un sumawongii, mais en un peu plus petit ?olivier971 a écrit :L elegans est un L peltata à palmes entières (cf Palmiers du Monde)
pour moi, j'en étais resté là ..
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olivier971
- Messages : 1275
- Enregistré le : 04 juin 2007 18:26
- Contact :
Re: Licuala elegans... Kesako ?
Mais Kew reconnait les 2 (les 3 avec le peltata) 
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wilfried couvet
- Messages : 305
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Re: Licuala elegans... Kesako ?
Ce que tu trouves sous le nom de Licuala elegans est du Licuala peltata var sumawongii , une grossière erreur de nomenclature propagée par certains commerçants et ouvrages peu sérieux.
Voici ce que disait John Dransfield à l'époque sur le palmtalk à ce sujet afin de t'expliquer :
"This is quite a straightforward one. Blume described Licuala elegans, a dwarf palm from Sumatra, way back in the mid 19th Century. On balance we think this is probably a synonym of Licuala pumila, again a dwarf palm from west Java, no more than about 50 cm tall. When Watana Sumawong first introduced his wonderful form of Licuala peltata with an entire leaf, it was quickly named informally Licuala elegans, since when I and other taxonomists have repeatedly pointed out that this name is completley inappropriate and incorerct for this Thai palm. It was not until Saw Leng Guan came along and provided a proper validated name that we had a name to use - Licuala peltata var. sumawongii. As far as I know, there are no photos of the real Licuala elegans - in any case it is probably Licuala pumila. So anything you see with a huge entire leaf named Licuala elegans is not, repeat not, and for one more time, not Licuala elegans, but Licuala peltata var. sumawongii. By the way, taxonomists had absolutely nothing to do with the naming of the Thai palm as Licuala elegans. I do not know who was responsible, but it may well have been Watana Sumawong himself. It is sometimes quite frustrating the way these incorrect names continue to persist in usage
I hope this clears up the problem for once and for all!
John "
Voilà il est clair à ce sujet , le Licuala elegans est bien une petite espèce endémique de Sumatra et serait peut être du Licuala pumila quant au Licuala elegans que tu trouves sur le marché c'est du Licuala peltata var. sumawongii.
A croire tu vois que la nomenclature c'est aussi parfois important et heureusement que le code international de la nomenclature existe ^^
Voici ce que disait John Dransfield à l'époque sur le palmtalk à ce sujet afin de t'expliquer :
"This is quite a straightforward one. Blume described Licuala elegans, a dwarf palm from Sumatra, way back in the mid 19th Century. On balance we think this is probably a synonym of Licuala pumila, again a dwarf palm from west Java, no more than about 50 cm tall. When Watana Sumawong first introduced his wonderful form of Licuala peltata with an entire leaf, it was quickly named informally Licuala elegans, since when I and other taxonomists have repeatedly pointed out that this name is completley inappropriate and incorerct for this Thai palm. It was not until Saw Leng Guan came along and provided a proper validated name that we had a name to use - Licuala peltata var. sumawongii. As far as I know, there are no photos of the real Licuala elegans - in any case it is probably Licuala pumila. So anything you see with a huge entire leaf named Licuala elegans is not, repeat not, and for one more time, not Licuala elegans, but Licuala peltata var. sumawongii. By the way, taxonomists had absolutely nothing to do with the naming of the Thai palm as Licuala elegans. I do not know who was responsible, but it may well have been Watana Sumawong himself. It is sometimes quite frustrating the way these incorrect names continue to persist in usage
I hope this clears up the problem for once and for all!
John "
Voilà il est clair à ce sujet , le Licuala elegans est bien une petite espèce endémique de Sumatra et serait peut être du Licuala pumila quant au Licuala elegans que tu trouves sur le marché c'est du Licuala peltata var. sumawongii.
A croire tu vois que la nomenclature c'est aussi parfois important et heureusement que le code international de la nomenclature existe ^^
"We will begin with palms, the loftiest and noblest of all vegetable forms, that to which the prize of beauty has been assigned by the concurrent voice of nations in all ages ."Alexander von Humboldt